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A Gun That Shoots More Accurately? :):)

Discussion in 'Paintball News' started by Robbo, Apr 6, 2011.

  1. Robbo Owner of this website for my sins ....

    Robbo
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    Ladies and Gentlemen Paintballers .. meet the New Ego Prime ....


    It’s all well and good bringing out something new with all its attendant advertising exclaiming all sorts of stuff that in normal circumstances amounts to jack sh!t.
    People tend to exaggerate their claims of performance and in some cases lie their fat ass off.

    And so, what is it exactly I’ve got here?
    I have an Ego11 that shoots more accurately, that’s what I got … Now, most people know Jack Wood, he’s the co-creator of all of Planet’s top markers; he is also one of our industry’s most respected individuals not just for his engineering expertise but also for his integrity .. He was about the most qualified person I could think of and so it was to him I turned to conduct the testing of my new Ego Prime.

    He compiled respective tables of data, the first relating to the fps variance of a standard Ego11 … in this test he shot around 50 balls and marked down their respective velocities with the use of a calibrated chronograph.

    He then went onto duplicate that velocity test with my new Ego Prime.

    The new Ego Prime performed well, much better than I or anybody else had anticipated; it’s no secret I was pretty surprised when the results came back.

    At this point it might prove useful to explain the area of a marker’s operation I was focused upon.
    It’s long been known that at high velocities the flow of air in a paintball gun becomes disordered and turbulent as it transitions thru the marker.
    The science of fluid mechanics underwrites this phenomenon and so I was on firm ground as long as I understood the subject, and luckily I did.

    As it travels from the air-tank to the back of the ball it undergoes many transitions and during those transitions, it will tend to produce a chaotic air flow in terms of its expansion through the gun.
    Generally speaking, this gas expansion eventually finds its way down the barrel thus propelling the ball outward but what’s important here is the flow characteristic of that air behind the ball.

    Fluid mechanics dictates that if you can reduce the disorder of the flow, you will improve upon its conformity and therefore its predictability.
    It’s actually easier said than done as I found out but after extensive testing, I did come up with a design modification to two components that provided the optimum effect on the marker’s performance in terms of its airflow through the marker.

    The new components reduced the somewhat chaotic air flow delivered to the back of the ball and in so doing; it gave the ball a more uniform acceleration and flight path.



    At this point, it might be best to explain exactly what laminar flow is; the laminar flow is what describes an air flow that has been streamlined and has its layers all moving in the same direction with no significant turbulence.

    This is what my new Ego Prime gives you the paintballer, no bs, no exaggeration, that’s what it does.
    I had always suspected I could improve the laminar flow characteristics of the marker but what I didn’t know was just how much effect it would have … the data I will now present shows you how much of an effect it has but just to make sure you have a good handle on what's going on here, I wanna put this data into some form of practical context.
    The main determinant in a marker’s accuracy will always be the ball you use and the outside conditions i.e. the wind effect experienced through the ball’s trajectory… and of course your skill as a shooter.
    I can do nothing about the paintballs, the wind or your skill level but what I can do is give you the best possible chance of translating your skill level to more accurate shooting.

    And with that in mind, what I can say for sure is .. with all things being equal, this new Ego Prime shoots more accurately .. as to how much?
    Let’s take a look at the data I will now present:-


    [​IMG]


    But what does this data actually say?

    Well, first off, this data hasn’t in any way been massaged, changed or fabricated.
    These are the tables Jack Wood drew up as a consequence of his testing procedures.


    And unlike a lot of the data presented on TV where they state something like 87% of women chose this hair wash over that, and in brackets they add [91 people tested] – what they don’t tell you is, they will have trialed many batches of 91 people [and other sample numbers] and they just cherry-picked the best results to put on TV.
    And in some cases, I am sure some of the batches tested would have presented data that countered any idea their product was superior; they just chose not to use that data.

    I haven’t done that … these are the results for the tests Jack did … end of .. duplicate them if you want, do what you like; it doesn’t change the fact this data was collected and presented with a 100% reliable procedure and presentation.
    I think Jack is planning to do more tests and as and when he does, I’ll present the results.

    Now, below is the data presented in graphical form for you techos :-


    [​IMG]

    Now, what does this graph really mean?

    It can be seen the darker Ego Prime curve is higher and thinner which basically means the shots were less spread around the mean…basically, we had a reduced set of shots that varied less in terms of fps from the average
    If the FPS spread variance is reduced in the Ego Prime, then this means two things, you can push the 300 limit [or whatever the event limit happens to be] significantly more and be confident you won’t go over, and it also, perhaps more importantly, must mean the Ego Prime shoots more accurately … if the fps variance is reduced as is shown in the Ego Prime curve then this means more shots were closer to the optimum i.e. more of the shots ended up where you aimed.

    This is an edge that serious ballers just cannot ignore if they truly want to compete at the top.
    The Ego Prime is exactly what it says on the tin ….. It’s the best, most accurate out there - it’s Prime time guys, it’s Ego Prime.


    And so, if you have any questions or queries concerning the New Ego Prime, just click on the following link and ask away, you can also order them from here as well ... Sales




    .
     
    zacattack, JFisher, RST and 7 others like this.
  2. Canon Fodder Go to your brother, kill him with your gun.

    Canon Fodder
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    What ROF was used to gather the data and was this consistant between markers? Manual trigger pulls or eclipse's trigger pulling machine? The statistics training in me is screaming for more info on this.
     
  3. P8ntballer.Com Administrator

    P8ntballer.Com
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    CF, I am sure Jack would have kept things to a very simple formula here in that he would have held the tests in semi mode and would have undoubtedly just had one trigger pull per registered shot .. it would have been foolhardy to do it any other way mate.

    Also, it makes no difference whatsoever if the trigger was manually activated or mechanically so, in that the electronics takes over once the trigger circuit has been activated and therefore negates any distinction between the two.

    As for consistency of parameters between both tests?
    I am 100% sure Jack Wood conducted these tests whereby the only difference between the two were the valve guide components .. the first test was a standard Ego11 as against the second test effectively being a standard Ego11 that included my modified valve set ..

    I hope this answers your questions CF and if you have any more, then please get back to me .. or just post in this thread.
     
    Canon Fodder likes this.
  4. peaty Under the INFLUENCE!

    peaty
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    obviously works for them they are tasty, personally robbo looking through these stats I am not a tech head to any degree but i still find the colored lines and numbers interesting. i definatly would love to get my hands on one to shoot one day.

    Do any current owners attend the NSPL at all i would love to see one in the face.
     
  5. basktm Active Member

    basktm
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    now im not disputing anything, just me being new and not understanding a lot about this subject.

    All though FPS will have a part ot play in the accuracy of a ball flight, but would this not mainly affect the dip/drop of a ball over a certain distance, so getting this less variable will mean more accurate in this form.

    My question is surely the biggest part of pure accuracy is the way in which the ball leaves the barrel/ or the way a ball is projected, given all factors being equal, i assume that every burst of air will cause a slightly different spin ???

    In which case any spin a ball takes will affect the flight path, So do these upgrades affect this ???

    has or can a test be done to prove accuracy in the way of target grouping, again given the same conditions (ideally indoor to take wind out of the equation), with marker fixed to a point to again confirm or take out player accuracy deviation.

    If this sort of test was conducted would or should the Prime come out showing considerably less spacing on the group ???

    these maybe silly questions, to be fair i dont truly understand the inner workings or any gat, its more an outside view, in respect any such test of x (maybe 100 or 200) amount of balls fired from a fixed location at a target, will confirm accuracy beyond any shadow of a doubt, this way you can control all effects (distance,wind,)
     
  6. Robbo Owner of this website for my sins ....

    Robbo
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    Hi Lettuce [I'm not sure I have ever written those previous two words in my life], I got tests coming out me ass mate, after the preliminary testing was done to determine the fps variance [which of course was always gonna be the major area for testing] then I think the next thing for me to do it to set up tests to look at comparative grouping of a standard Ego and an Ego Prime.

    I think we already know the Standard Ego11 is one of the best and most accurate markers anyway, just take a look at the results from Paris and around the world to determine that and any testing I was gonna conduct was always gonna be in terms of a comparison with an Ego11 without my valve set ... it's the only true test you can make to determine whether or not my new valve set works or not.

    But look, the bottom line is this .... the valve set sure don't make the Ego11 perform worse thats for sure, it can only improve the air flow and the only thing in question is to what degree it improves performance... even if the valve set made no difference at all, the Ego Prime is still gonna be one the best markers in the world ... it's a no lose situation either way :)
     
  7. WihGlah Autococker Tech

    WihGlah
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    The calculations now have my seal of approval:


    Pictures tell a thousand words:

    [​IMG]

    Standard internals on the left, new ones on the right. (red lines = +/- 3 stdevs)


    As for consistency .v. accuracy, I'm no expert but given a choice, I would choose a more consistent gun over a less consistent one.

    Heck - I bought a hush bolt for my Ego so I'd probably pick these up if they were available.
     
  8. AirHead Still tastin' paint

    AirHead
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    Is there any plans to make a Robbo version of a spoolie marker? Don't get me wrong - the Prime looks amazing and from the data it obviously shoots amazing as well - but I'm a spoolie guy at heart. Anything special in the pipeline for us?

    Geo Prime pehaps, to continue the trend?
     
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  9. Robbo Owner of this website for my sins ....

    Robbo
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    Hey Airhead, I've already designed the basic changes needed and I will be working with Jack to make sure the new changes are appropriate in terms of simple machining ... the Geo Prime is alive and well and I'll have more information pretty soon ... I hope :)
     
  10. hello_moto Well-Known Member

    hello_moto
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    badass :D

    I will wait for that and bide my time in acquiring a Geo too soon. Saves me the hassle of looking to our US compatriots over at Nation for pooty mods and all that.
     
    CraigofScotland likes this.

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