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Dye in trouble ???

Spikerz

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Mar 25, 2014
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There's a nine page thread on pbn that makes for a heck of a read. Loos like dye defaulted on a loan, no clue how much at loan is or for what, but it seems like something funky is going on.

While I doubt that DYE will file for bankruptcy I wouldn't doubt seeing a tightening of the purse strings that has already happened, with the lack of a millennium tent or presence, plus DYE teams dropping like flies, and Alex Goldman and ARod leaving Ironmen over the past two days. It seems to be a portent that something will happen this year with DYE. Maybe it's just cutting back on expenses and that's it, I wouldn't want to see an owner of the PSP and a large industry company go under.
 

Spikerz

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The 141 article I think said or someone in the PBN article said no tent for DYE at puget. That's not good. If they haven't even signed the sponsorship deal that's extra bad.
 

I used to good.Honest

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Oct 20, 2013
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Bodmin
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Rumours been around since before bittburg last year.
In fact a few of us even started our own rumour that Kee were going to buy out dye and rebrand it.
see if you can guess the name we made up?
I know a few companies that would go to the wall if they had to pay their creditors or all royalty fees owed for patents owned by others.
There is no money in paintball for Dye, the money is made in other areas. I can see the paintball side going to another big name paintball company, no prizes for guessing which one. but I think the loss of the director of the cnc side is more worrying to them than the paintball side.
seriously since mikko left things have just gone downhill (excuse the snowboard pun) and the vans deal cost them big time.
basically Dye paintball products will still be made in everywhere other than the united states until kee buys them, then they will be made in the good old U. S of Taiwan.
 

I used to good.Honest

UKPSF #7126
Oct 20, 2013
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Bodmin
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In 29 years of being involved in paintball (with a 15 year break) it's nice to see that nothing has changed and rumours are the mainstay of paintball.
since MPI (major paintball industries) got fleeced by a certain few people, mentioning no names (wildermouth, cough cough) they were going to take over the world, then it was brass eagle then it was wdp, then it was gino, then it was dye, then it was kee,
they will all do other things because there is just not that much profit in paintball, the paint prices are just ridiculously low now and that just can't carry on. hence why encapsulating factories are closing in the west and new ones opening up in the far east, it's all just about making the product cheaper, and eventually the quality will just be pants and there will just be gino and kee left making paint, one in europe and one in the far east.

You heard it here first.
:)
 

Spikerz

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Mar 25, 2014
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Gino sort of did takeover the paintball world for awhile. Paintball is like Asia in the game of Risk, trying to take over the whole thing is damn near impossible and you spread yourself so thin you can get beat down quick.

The CNC side to the DYE house is a huge loss.

It'll take some time to see if their other business units can float the paintball side until it levels out.

If there really is a divorce in the mix then things could get messy.
 

Robbo

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Hmm, lots of people with lots of opinions on what may or may not be happening but there's always speculation at times like this but on this occasion, I think it's being stirred up Stateside by a couple of people.

I know this much, Dye Precision in the US does not own Dye Europe, Dave YB owns it.
And as far as I know, Dye Europe hasn't got any bank liens on the business, or indeed any investment companies propping it up which I hope clarifies a few things if only for this side of the Atlantic anyway.

One thing though, there are people in our industry who would like nothing more than to see Dye fall but let me tell you something here, if Dye [US] pops, then it's really bad for our industry as a whole.
Dye have for a long time been our industry's front runner when it comes to top-end gear to wear and shoot ... and they've been at the top of that pile for very good reasons, basically, they deserved it.

However, the financial climate in the US, certainly in terms of paintball, has been dire these past 7 years or so, and there seems to be no sign of any green shoots anywhere that might indicate recovery is imminent.
Every company Stateside is hurting and it's merely a matter of degree .. and so there's always gonna be rumours popping up here, there and everywhere.
The customer demographic our sport previously relied upon to fuel its previous growth has been usurped by a demographic that's on average, about 10 years younger .. and it is this factor that has been one of the root causes of our financial problems.

All paintball companies in the US have had to pull their belts in and tread water in the hope there'll be no further dips in turnovers but alas, there have been.

As for Dye [US]?
I don't know what their financial situation is but it's fair to say that when people start splurting about bills not being paid, it doesn't help matters for obvious reasons but just for the record, Dye Europe has been paying all its suppliers etc
If they hadn't been then I'd know because Dye advertise with me and there have been NO payment problems at all;
As most of you know, I've known Dave for over 20 years and I can honestly say, everything is fine this side of the Atlantic with regard to Dye Europe.
I emailed Dave yesterday and if he wishes to make something pubic then I'll post it but I think his best response is 'no response' in which case, I won't be posting anything up.

Let's hope everything's ok otherwise it's bad news for all of us one way or the other.
One other thing, Dave started Dye on his own with his own money.
Dave ended up marrying John Gregory's daughter Rhonda, and John was the guy who created and ran JT paintball with his wife Rita before selling up for 32 million bucks to Kee.
Dye was already well established when John gave Rhonda and Dave a cash wedding present that was obviously instrumental in fuelling Dye's evolution but it was never what some people made out in terms of John's monetary gift being wholly responsible for Dye's success.

The reason Dave did so well was because the guy was working sometimes 18 hour days, and I know this to be true because I've stayed with Dave several times when going to California and seen for myself just what his working day consisted of, I got tired just watching him go to work let alone actually doing it.
Dave earned Dye's success, it wasn't gifted to him.

The other thing I know, Dave had long realised that the US market was showing no real signs of recovery after the greatest slow-down we've ever witnessed in paintball.
And as such, he focussed upon the far-east to secure Dye's overall stability - Europe weren't in the same degree of recession as the US hence Dave consequently invested in Europe and the Far-East. The US languished and in relative terms, it still does.
I don't know the fate of Dye [US] but if it's in trouble, it will affect all of us in one way or the other, and not in a good way because our sport needs the likes of Planet, Dye and Kee, GiMilsim etc
Let's hope this isn't a harbinger to come because our industry and sport can't really afford too many more knock-backs .....
 

Spikerz

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Mar 25, 2014
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Pete with the overall health in the states for economic growth being pretty decent for most industries. Discretionary funding has freed up for many folks, including me before I moved to Ireland.
Team attendance is up at events in general.
What is driving the slowdown for companies?
Is it a case of trying to cut costs to levels that consumers will pay and the margins are just too small to be viable?

I'm not familiar enough with the business aspect of paintball currently to know. Thought you'd give some good insights