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Dusty

Don't run, you'll only die tired....
May 19, 2004
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A good coach will know the standard they need. Players don't actually need to, once the coach sees they're good enough then that's it.

It's a fairly simple game at the end of the day, people over complicate things in training I think.

Master gun handling first, breakouts, individual skills, 1st ball accuracy, running and gunning, snap shooting.

Then move onto game scenarios. If you practice 2v2, 3v2, 2v1 etc when it happens in a competitive game it won't be a shock.

Team work and communications can be standardised but team spirit and rapport can't be trained as such, it can be developed though.
 
Oct 5, 2002
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But some will be naturally better than others and what happens after a while if the coach realises they're not at the standard that's required and might not be able to get to it?

What I'm saying is it could be possible with proven players if they're willing to commit and on the flip side you're more likely to get commitment but it might not be possible
 

Robbo

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Firstly, apologies for length of post but there's a point to be made, a few points actually .....

Lettuce - I think we're now assuming that we're able select the players but not exclusively from the pros or semi-pros.
In some respects it's easier to train players who aren't pro or semi because they tend to be the rounded item already and don't leave a lot of room to work with.

The first six months of training would involve not much else apart from drills and the last would be combinations of drills and 5 v 5 games.
It's really important [IMHO] that the 5v5 games aren't free-running .. by this I mean, each game would have a purpose, that purpose would be decided upon by the coach who would look to focus the players on a certain component of play.

As an example, the theme might be left-handed shooting and so the game would begin with all the players sitting behind their pre-selected primaries [No break-out] and the 'game-on' would be called by the coach - the players would begin playing using their left-hand exclusively [Right-hand if you're southpaw] .... the coach then manages this particular session with no predesignated game time .. it continues until the coach is satisfied and then everyone gets reset behind their original primaries and it starts again.
Coach intervention is important here so's he can stop the game at any time to make a point - once the point has been made, the game continues with no reset ...

This is focus training and something we used extensively in the first few months of training Nexus up.
In my opinion, and from what I saw, and from what the players said in feed-back, this approach paid dividends.

Most people might know or remember that we ]Nexus] also focussed heavily on snap-shooting spending whole days continually focussed upon snap-shooting from various positions, standing, kneeling, left-handed, right-handed etc
If you look at most people who snap-shoot, it doesn't look too complicated but it can be broken down [if you know what to look for] and then it's reassembled in stages as you train it, huge dividends are possible.
Every seminar/training day I've done since we developed it, I've included the mechanics of this shot and tried to pass it on to as many players as is possible.
The two main considerations when training this **** are accuracy, and minimising exposed profile.
There are two ways to achieve a reduced profile, the first is time, the second is the method itself.
And just so's we all know what I mean by a reduced profile, I'm talking about your target profile, what does your opponent see of you and how long does he see it for ....

As some of you guys may know/remember, I used to meet up with Sergey, the owner of the Russian Legion, many times when he flew into London and he once said to me, 'Pete, the devil is always in the detail' ..... now, since he's a frikkin billionaire, I thought it best to listen to him.
He was right of course, the devil is in the detail but most people don't want to bother too much with details, they want quick and easy results, they want McDonald's techniques .... and that ain't possible if you're making a serious attempt to improve your skill-sets.

If you look at boxers, most all the pros [and amateurs] throw right-crosses, left-hooks, right-hooks etc in much the same way ... that's not coincidence, it's because that particular punch technique has been so refined, so optimised, it gives the boxer a blueprint on how to throw your 'bread and butter' shots ... paintball could learn a lot from boxing in this respect.
The guys who I coach down my boxing club will spend hours [per week] on the bag or on the pads, they know what I've asked them to do and they're willing to invest their time and effort in developing their own skill-set.
There's nothing stopping us ballers from at least trying to approximate what the boxers do ....

I'll leave you with one last account that may prove helpful in this thread ...
After Nexus had gone through their training regime, we went to a Millennium event in Toulouse.
We got to play Dynasty, who were at that time, dominating everyone.
I was standing with Chuck Hendsch who was the captain and part-owner of Dynasty but he was also an ex teammate of mine from when I was on the All Americans and so we knew each other well enough.

About half way through the game, one of our players, Jamie Abbott slid into a bunker on the 50 right next to us on the tape, in front of him was one of the Dynasty players who'd see Jamie slide in front of him, no more than twenty feet away.

Now, because this was a tape-line bunker position, Jamie and the Dynasty player were right in front of myself and Chuck ... my stomach was churning like an Indesit washing machine as Jamie settled in and assumed the position we'd practiced so many, many times .... it took less than twenty seconds before the Dynasty player was snapped out of the game with a goggle shot causing Chuck to splutter something like 'Jeeeeeeeze' ... he was surprised - I pretended I wasn't ... Jamie perfectly executed the snap-shot we'd spent so long in developing - I never forgot that one instance of play because in that seminal moment of play, all our training crystalised in front of me and more importantly, Jamie went onto become a truly fantastic and accomplished snap-shooter.

Was it luck?
Could have been but I like to think people make their own luck in this world, and on that day, Jamie made his, much to the abject disappointment of Chuck and the Dynasty player who'd had his armband removed by many months of training.
 

Dusty

Don't run, you'll only die tired....
May 19, 2004
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I have to agree, it's the little things which make the big differences. I see exactly the same in Taekwondo, a half step to one side or the other, forwards or backwards can totally ruin your opponents game plan OR give you an angle they never saw coming. The position of your foot at the end of a kick can determine whether your knee is protecting your trunk scoring area or leaving it exposed.

Max Lundqvist did a weekend with us and his snap shot technique meant you never saw any more than half of his mask AT MOST. That said, he had enough clearance to get his gun out in that little space and make an accurate shot. It seemed to me that he had started with his desired result and reverse engineered it to find the most efficient way to arrive at it.

The hardest part about coaching people is convincing them to remain motivated to do the bread and butter stuff quite simply because it's boring. All we want to do is play ball, not drill, it's human nature. Boring drills vs games and fun??

I teach people Taekwondo and before they start I warn them that the first 4 belts are not going to be exciting. Once they get past that though, the fun stuff starts. Not because they're learning new techniques but they're figuring out how to apply and advance the basics properly. If you can't do the basics though, you'll never be able to do the fancy stuff.

Next time you're training take an empty paint box and stick it halfway up the field. See how many people can hit that thing first time. You'll be surprised and not necessarily in a good way.
 

Robbo

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Jul 5, 2001
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Jimbo, you've actually touched upon something I hadn't covered which is, players, some of them anyway, just want to play ball when it comes to training and it's this issue, well, one of them, that has helped sentence our UK game to a state of unmitigated mediocrity.
If players just want to play ball, which by the way is fine if you don't want to achieve anything, then those players need to look for another team as far as I'd be concerned.
If a team employs/uses a coach then it's implicit there's a job to do and as such, you need to work for it.
This of course causes problems but maybe most players really do just wanna play ball and for those guys/girls, it's best they leave the team which may seem harsh but if they stay then it has a tendency to drag the serious players down to their level ...
I think if all the players and the coach are on the same page from the beginning, you'd be really surprised at just how much you can achieve in training ... it was an eye-opener for me when I witnessed it at first hand.
If I ask all the people who read this post/thread, how many people/teams do you know that talk the talk but somehow manage to avoid walking the walk ... as I said previous, it's so easy for players/coaches to BS.
One last thing [I promise] these players who just want to play and not train seriously, if they put in a little more effort and could experience a significant improvement to their own skill-sets, then the enjoyment, the satisfaction in knowing you've achieved something significant outweighs any enjoyment of just balling at weekends for the fun of it - Go ask Jamie Abbott for proof of that, in fact, go ask any of the original Nexus squad, some of them are still around.
 

Spikerz

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Mar 25, 2014
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I used to do drills with the Ironmen. One of my favourite was the paper plate on a stick. Have a teammate use a paper plate stapled to a stick behind a bunker. Pop it out a bit and you snap out and 1-2 ball it.

It helped a lot with knowing where your shots will end up.

Max and Joy are still some of the absolute best off the break and snap shots to play the game. Having him as a guest coach would be pretty incredible.
 

Dusty

Don't run, you'll only die tired....
May 19, 2004
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I used to do drills with the Ironmen. One of my favourite was the paper plate on a stick. Have a teammate use a paper plate stapled to a stick behind a bunker. Pop it out a bit and you snap out and 1-2 ball it.

It helped a lot with knowing where your shots will end up.

Max and Joy are still some of the absolute best off the break and snap shots to play the game. Having him as a guest coach would be pretty incredible.

If there are any of the Karnage lads still playing ask them how I used to make them train at our place :) Robbie was probably at the Maximus Clinic, Tomas too.

I'll tell you something else too, it worked.
 
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Spikerz

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Max pioneered the whole "roll out" snap shot, which was pretty revolutionary back in the day, and still a solid foundation for shooting now.

I actually preferred drills to scrimmages, weirdly enough.
 

Robbo

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Spike, with no disrespect intended, either to yourself or Max, we had the roll-out nailed by end of 2002, in 2003, we played our first NPPL at HB and also to the Toulouse event I mentioned earlier.
Some people had picked up on the teams snap-shooting technique because it was getting noticed due to its results.
During that year I also taught people at different seminars we did and so it spread organically all the way through the more conscientious of teams/players.
I have heard several people lay claim to this technique but it was the guys from the original Nexus who first deployed the roll-out snap shot.
 
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Spikerz

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Ahh could be then, I did see Grayson Goff selling that method on his site, and it was kind of funny. A bunch of guys were talking about it in Puget last year, between he, Ollie, Dave Bains, and Greenspan. Ollie basically said, look use whatever is quickest for the bunker you're playing behind.