Gun Control politics on both sides of the pond

[Mark]

What makes me laugh is

Originally posted by duffistuta
the way certain groups leap on the 'personal freedom' bandwagon and then off again when it suits 'em.

Now you just KNOW that these are the same people who, when Clause 28 (Hotpoint? is that the right fella) was passed to help stop raves, and when the age of consent was being debated, were all too eager to applaud the Govts' stance in restricting other people's freedoms because they, by and large, didn't like them. As soon as the boot's on the other foot, suddenly freedom is an important issue.

It's the hypocrisy that gets me - if they'd just said 'We want our guns back, we haven't done anything wrong and indeed I suspect you're breaking European Law in taking them off us' I wouldn't mind.

Seatbelts in cars for ****'s sake...****ers.

The section you are talking about when taken litrally (which is why our laws are written in that way) when you have a party in your home it is illegal. Doesn't get enforced too regular, but it does happen. makes you think twice about having that house warming "do" now doesn't it?


(Haven't been slacking, only found 5 sites so far to back what I was saying earlier in this thread......but to post them would just perpetuate the row wouldn't it )

 

[JoseDominguez]

My sig may say I am from Australia but only for the last year or so I am English and Know the laws and situation as well as you do...
(posted by Pete Martin)

Well in that case, you know that airguns recieve a lot of bad press for negative use, and target shooting rarely gets a mention whereas paintball gets virtually none either way.
So I'll say it again, airgun crime:high, paintball crime: low. In the UK. I am not condoning/condemning anything, I am commenting on the political climate, It looks like airguns are going to go, I don't want to go with them. Read my posts, I'm talking about what appears to be happening, I'm not asking for a ban on anything. So, stop having a go at me, and have a go at the press, politicians etc... who are jumping on the bandwagon, because banning something gets votes, as long as the sun will write about it (print pictures anyway).
Because, frankly, complaining to me and making witty comments will accomplish nothing.
So, facts, no opinion.
1) paintball gets very little media coverage positive or negative.
2) airguns get a lot of negative press mainly due to irresponsible use not criminal intent.
3) the home office are aware that paintball and airguns are separate (see the earlier post).
4) The Uk government is currently making moves against anything even vaguely gun-like.

So (back to opinion), I think that the UK government will go after airgunners now (I think that's sad for airgun sportsman) and aren't even considering us yet, as banning us won't win votes, as we aren't a percieved menace (the sun hasn't decided we're dangerous). Clear enough? as it appears that some people seem to think I'm calling for a ban on everything.

I'm not, just cell-phones, microwave oven, red M&Ms and Wednesdays.

 

[Pete Martin]

Jose

I am not having a go at you, I thought we were just having a discusion about two different points of view...

the way your opinion is coming accross is that 'Air guns' are going to be banned so lets separate ourselves from them and we'll be OK...

what I'm saying is, is that we should be defending against these law changes now because we are not going to be alright if we leave it alone, as you said

"4) The Uk government is currently making moves against anything even vaguely gun-like."

Like it or not we can call our equipment Markers as long as we like but they are still 'Gun Like' .... and just because we maybe not in the direct spot light at present as far as the gov. are concerned we will infact be the next sport to be condemend or banned by them...

lets fight against the laws changes now and protect our sport & our right to play it in the future...

 

[Baca Loco]

Originally posted by JoseDominguez
So, facts, no opinion.
1) paintball gets very little media coverage positive or negative.
2) airguns get a lot of negative press mainly due to irresponsible use not criminal intent.
3) the home office are aware that paintball and airguns are separate (see the earlier post).
4) The Uk government is currently making moves against anything even vaguely gun-like.

So (back to opinion), I think that the UK government will go after airgunners now (I think that's sad for airgun sportsman) and aren't even considering us yet

What Teej and Martin are saying, among other things, is today it may be airguns but the way things are progressing, tomorrow it will be pball markers--(and Australia is a glimpse into the UK's possible future)--
and if no one will stand up against unreasonable legislation aimed at one group pretty soon there's nobody left to stand up with you when it comes to restricting pball markers.

Edit added--Pete, you beat me to it.

 

[Mark/Static]

Just FYI

"You have every right to defend yourself, with reasonable force with items which you have with you like an umbrella, hairspray or keys can be used against the attacker. The law however doesn't allow carrying anything which can be described as an offensive weapon."

http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/crimprev/personalsafety.htm

"Police have been ordered not to bother investigating crimes such as burglary, vandalism and assaults...."

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2003/01/12/nburg12.xml&sSheet=/news/2003/01/12/ixnewstop.html

 

[JoseDominguez]

Yeah, I saw that, I'm thinking of taking up burglary, seems like a fair career move if no-ones going to do anything about it.
Anyone want to buy a really big dog?

 

[JoseDominguez]

I give it three weeks 'till the UK is like Mad Max. Just more polite.

Posted by baca loco
What Teej and Martin are saying, among other things, is today it may be airguns but the way things are progressing, tomorrow it will be pball markers--(and Australia is a glimpse into the UK's possible future)--
and if no one will stand up against unreasonable legislation aimed at one group pretty soon there's nobody left to stand up with you when it comes to restricting pball markers.

Yes, I agree, unfortunately the UK doesn't work like that, if we stand up to defend it now (when they aren't after us) then we'll just get banned quicker. After all, if our government want rid of something then it's gone.
E.g. Beef on the bone (still no proof it's related to CJD either and I did some of the research)
Eggs, remember that one? 'cos british eggs got banned for a while.
Hunting knives.
Anything remotely related to "ninjas"
Hand guns.
Separate MMR vaccines (and I teach Autistic kids)
So, some banned due to percieved danger, some due to medical scares and some because they needed a front page in the SUN. But all of them had supporters and each ban cost many jobs. It didn't stop them.
They aren't after us yet, I hope they never start.

 

[Wolf]

I've stayed out of this thread on the "Agree to Disagree" mind set (aka - You get what you deserve

Anyway, if someone over there does not bring Tony Martin out for a few pints (and/or some paintball!) when he is released in July I will be even more disappointed than usual in you UK guys.

This guy should be treated as a hero! What is next over there? When people break in to a UK house in the future, you will not only have to meekly surrender your belongings, you will also have to roll over and let them take a turn with you. Geesh! It sounds like Massachusetts in the 1970s

Rick

 

[JoseDominguez]

Possibly wort looking into the case mate, he only got manslaughter on the grounds of diminished responsibility due to "paranoid delusion" and had previously stated "gypsies should be put in a field and machine gunned", he also had two other convictions for gun related lunacy, when he had gone to friends houses to argue, in one case he smashed windows and the other a shot was fired from a pistol.
He shot the "gypsy" as he tried to escape shouting "I'm sorry, please don't, mum" (the kid was sixteen).
Is it worth mentioning that whilst Tony Martin was afraid for his life his three rottweillers were chasing the two Gypsy kids out of his house? (these facts are from the official report).
So, I don't think I'll be buying him a pint for shooting a boy in the back as he ran from a rottweiller.
Point is, their are other cases of miscarriages of justice that are a lot clearer cut, this one is so muddy that I don't think anyone can tell. Tony Martin support posts are the last thing we need connected to paintball in the UK, considering the current climate.

 

[Wolf]

Okay, your extra info has swung me to admit he is a nut.

But come on, you do realize that the Gypseys are the ones that fly the black NATO helicopters. Some day they will outlaw aluminum foil so they will finally have unrestricted access to the microchips they have imbedded in our brains.

No, really